Magic Systems: What's yours like? [and AMA, I guess]

The Chatters
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Oh my gosh, you have variations of meanings :open_mouth: That’s impressive. This is the kind of thing I would read extensively when word-searching for something for my fantasy world.

You have a dictionary for Zispoel? Is the language done or are you still expanding it to this day? For how many years have you been working on it?

Yes! I was right! XD

And you have PROTO :open_mouth: That’s impressive. You’ve thought of everything for this language!

The name “Elgana” is inspired by Proto-Germanic, btw.

Amounts? How to measure magic though?

Also, how do people use the magic? Channeling into objects? Saying spells? Using runes? All of it?

Ahah, Meistezon… Zon is…Hero? Or is it Earth. But Meiste is earth, right?

A pickup truck in her wallet XD I just imagined a scene where someone asks her why she has it in her wallet and she just says, “Because I can resize it at will.” lol

Gotten a little into physics now… :eyes:

Okay, so if you learn Earth magic, are there things you can do with it that isn’t typical Earth magic but an advanced form?

In my story… Aerisi can use ice magick, yes, but they can also suck ice into their bodies to thaw small things. It’s an advanced form of ice magick. A character saves a child from frostbite this way. He sucks the ice into himself and although he will be cold to the core, the cold never bothered him anyway :stuck_out_tongue: He won’t die from frostbite. He does eventually warm back up again.

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Ugh i need a dictionary. I should put one together because microsoft excel is not the best for keeping word meanings. It’s very helpful for sound changes though! If I ever manage to make a dictionary, remind me to tag you lol.

Zispoel has been a passion project since my Freshman year of High School. So… 4 years? I like to call it “Latin and Chinese had a baby,” but it’s (of course) more complicated.

I’d never consider a language “done,” since languages in the real world are always changing, too! I’m always adding words and translations and phrases.

Lolol ty!

I built a language family tree I can share with you, if you’d like—It’s not super big but it’s not nothing lol.

Oh what word?

Meiste is Earth, yes. Meistezon is “(they who are) of Earth.” Meiste in the Genetive Case. I think the Genetive case later becomes a person-marking derivational suffix.

Yep that sounds like her

Mmm it depends. People can combine magic (by touching each other) so they can combine abilities into new abilities. I can follow up on this some more if you want lol

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I sat at my desk laughing at this :'D oh man, that must be absolutely terrifying! I wonder if anyone believes their story when they get back home!

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That’s cool. What prompted you to start making your own language?

(I also just remembered I tried to make my own language in my freshman year of high school XD What is it about freshman year of high school, huh? lol But unlike you, I was not successful because the intricacies of the grammar just…I couldn’t. Too complicated. I was more into building the world and traditions and such.)

Yes, please. I would love to indulge in that. I can’t even begin to imagine making a language, but I do enjoy reading etymology and word origins :wink:

That’s true! I thought of that after posting my reply :stuck_out_tongue: Still wanted to know what you’d say. But there would come a time where the basic grammar is completed, right? Like, for years now, there are words with silent "e"s in the English language. It hasn’t changed. It’s kind of like the basics of English now.

Idk if I’m making sense :crazy_face: Maybe this is my question: Do you have grammar rules that are pretty much set in stone?

A language family… :eyes:
yes XD

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A bunch of them.

Okay, so, I realized I had to reorganize everything and not all of it is Proto-Germanic. Some is Proto-West Germanic and I don’t know why these are different yet :stuck_out_tongue:

So, Elgana has two meanings. Basically, the meaning/breakdown that I gave it as the writer (Proto this and that), and the meaning that it has in the fantasy world (in Elgana, these were just sounds and not actual words).

Elgana in the fantasy world can be broken up into four parts: El, Gan, An, A. El means “protector”, Gan means magick, An means “wandering”, and A is for “Goddess”. Elgana means “Wandering goddess, a magical protector”. The wandering goddess is the moon.

In the head of the writer, Elgana is broken into four parts: helm, gan, wand, aus.

Helm
  • From Germanic Name: “helm” meaning “protector” appearing in names such as “Helmut” or “Wilhelm/William”

Note: This is the only one that doesn’t have Proto-Germanic origin/inspiration. If you look up “protector”, you get to Proto-Germanic “skelduz” which means “shield” and I could say I used the “el”, but I think that’s pushing it :sweat_smile:

Gan
  • From Germanic Name: “gan” meaning “magic” appearing in names such as “Wolfgan” or “Morgan”
  • Proto-West Germanic “gān” meaning “to go” (from Proto-Germanic “gāną” with the same meaning)
  • Proto-West Germanic “galdr” meaning “singing, song” or “incantation” (from Proto-Germanic “galdraz” meaning “singing, song” or “charm, incantation, spell”)

Note: the “galdr” part is added to make it magical :stuck_out_tongue: I don’t have to have it…but it helps link to the fantasy meaning of the word “gan” and it’s kinda cool to mention when people ask.

Wand
  • From Germanic Name: “wand” or “wandal” meaning “wander” or “wend” appearing in names such as “Wandefrid” or “Wandalbert”
  • Proto-Germanic “wandilaz” meaning “to wanderer”

Note: Does this mean Wanda is an adventurer? :stuck_out_tongue:

Aus
  • From Germanic Name: “aus, aust, eost” meaning “radiant; a goddess” appearing in names such as “Aurvandil”, “Austrad”, or “Ostruin”
  • Proto-Germanic “Austrǭ” meaning “Easter, springtime” and it is the name of a goddess. Specifically, a West Germanic spring goddess Ēostre who is related to Easter and dawn as well.

Note: The part about the goddess is just my personal interest thing :stuck_out_tongue: Nothing to do with Elgana.

I know you didn’t ask for this much detail but since you’re a language person, I thought you might appreciate it :stuck_out_tongue: I like breaking down words.

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That’s from Latin, isn’t it? I have yet to understand what it means :sweat_smile: Latin still confuses me. There’s so many variations of one word and I can’t figure out why.

Anyway, back to magic questions:

Ahhhh, interesting. If they combine abilities into new abilities, have there been cases where the new ability becomes commonplace? Also, how many abilities can be combined? Is there a limit?

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Nope :crazy_face:

Or they get the sympathetic “sure, sweetie, I believe you” type of thing XD

I’m now imagining a scientist that tries time and again to unsuccessfully prove this and eventually goes insane.

Many older Sorcerers actually know about the breathable space. Some of them had to go there to make the portals. But they keep it to themselves. Imagine if everyone knew of breathable space? No one would use the portals and traffic in space would be insane.

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Well it really ramped up during Covid. I found a ton of videos online about making languages–all of them are good! Love David Peterson’s videos on YouTube: he made Dothraki and High Valerian in Game of Thrones.

That’s true yeah. I find the language and culture to be inseparable–metaphors come into common speech lol.

:joy: That’s the stuff for me too.

Oh for sure the grammar is done for Classical Zispoel and Modern Ipol (but god almighty Modern Ipol has weird grammar and split ergativity).

Yep for sure:

Classical Zispoel has a Latin-like word order: Subject-Object-Verb. It also is an analytical language with a lot of inflections depending on the word (including a dual-plural distinction).

Modern Ipol, on the other hand, has free word order and nearly twenty verb distinctions. The nouns get easier, because the Masculine (grammatical) gender merged with the Neuter producing a masculine-feminine split (as though it were Spanish).

Ugh I could go on forever.

Wooh! Here it is!
Languages marked red are dead langauges–languages marked white are living langauges.

Zispoel-languages
Zispoel-languages3357×1581 301 KB

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Only marginally different, iirc. Some weird phonology changes like aja > aːː

Oh shit alright that word really packs a punch then.

Super cool :bangbang:

I mean hey maybe–

(later becomes “went” in English)

(OE: gonne/gōn)

no i totally appreciate it lmao

why don’t more people do things with her???

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Aha! I know some Spanish. Is it though, the same as Spanish, where just because something ends with an “o” doesn’t mean it’s always masculine?

That language family tree! More languages than I thought there would be :open_mouth: Have you thought up words for all the dead languages?

I can’t remember if you said people say spells or not when using the magic… What language is associated with the magic?

Also, how long did it take for Classical Zispoel to become a dead language?

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Yes, I can see that :wink:

Yep, there we go :wink: No, I didn’t mean the pun at first but now that I noticed it, yes, I do mean the pun.

There’s not much story on her. Well, not Wikipedia :sweat_smile: Maybe if you dig more into it. Also, she’s associated with the east… maybe if you have a magick system or a world where direction has something to do with things. North, south, east, west…goddesses or gods for every direction… That’d be kinda cool.

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Very many languages exhibit a genetive case–Latin, of course, being one of them, but so does Faarsi, German, etc… It’s the third-most common case behind the Accusative. The genetive case almost makes things adjectives lol. It’s like “of ___”

Well, there’s no limit, but magic can’t be swapped–that’s like swapping souls. Instead, touching is the equivalent of combining souls for a little bit, and using each other’s magic.

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Oh lmao no the Classical Zispoel masculine ending is -r and neuter was -ø (no ending) so they merged into -ø, and the Feminine went from -rief > -r. So -ø is the masculine ending and -r is the feminine ending (With some exceptions).

of course, there’s also the “hard endings” derived from -tief/-t in the Feminine and Masculine, which become -ts/-ø in the feminine and masculine respectively.

Classical Zispoel was cursed.

Depends. Proto O’as “exists” but none of its daughter langauges

Classical Zispoel exists, but Old Zispoel does not. Neither do the Dulgoqi languages bc I’m lazy

There are a lot of songs about magic, but there’s no magical language. Since the Hero of Life (the “first Hero”) was Zenestian (and spoke Zispoel), Zispoel is the lingua-franca for magic, although the same concepts are often written in Åtepsi. (Ugh Åtepsi is weird).

A “rough timeline”:

  • About 6000 years prior, Proto-Zispoel emerges. 4000 years ago, some of those speakers migrate to another subcontinent by boat and settle it. 3000 years ago, Old Zispoel diverges from the protolanguage, creating Old O’a in the process.
  • 2000 years ago, Classical Zispoel emerges from Old Zispoel.
  • Classical Zispoel remains for about 1000 years, but by 200 years in, Old Zenéþ had already begun to emerge. By 50 years after the Hero of Life returned, Classical Zispoel had officially fragmented into Old Ipol and Old Zenéþ.
  • Five hundred years later, the Dulgoqi languages die in a series of clan wars over a port on the Southern Coast.
  • Four hundred years ago, Middle Ipol diverged into the Sine Languages (literally “Farmer Speak”) and Ipol (the “Standard Language”). Much like Standard Mandarin, Ipol is a prestige language (spoken by King Iziser and most of the citizens of Ir Nouzonif).
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:rofl:

His teleportation is limited to places he’s been to. So, if he has been on a certain planet, he can transport himself there. But he cannot go back or forward in time nor can he go to random places. It has to be a specific place. So like, if he’d been to a cave in Mars, he could transport himself to Mars from Earth, but it can only be to that cave.

It’s a mixture between having extra privileges due to their status and being gifted an extra power by their gods.

:rofl:

They have two legs though their knees/legs bend backward. And they have four arms—two from their shoulders, and two from their torso.

I didn’t add what they looked like prior to my MC meeting them at first (which now, I realize I need to lol) but this is what I said:

When she came closer into the sunlight, Nicolas’s jaw hit the ground, completely shocked to see her pointy ears perked up, and how her bluish scaly skin moved in waves.

And then later, when they go to their secretive city, their bodies are explained:

Wooden huts stood in rows, going on for miles, creating a street in the middle as Koelegians in simple clothing draped over their chests and hips. They weren’t exactly humanoid, however. They had two legs, but their knees bent backward, and an extra bone extended from their calves. They had four arms; a pair attached to their shoulders and another from their long and thin torsos. While they walked like humans, their bodies were made for running, hunting.

There are, though there’s fewer men within their society. They’re typically used for breeding. :rofl: And yes, they reproduce, though they don’t lay eggs… entirely. Like, they don’t have this hardshell of an egg, but when birthed, the fetus is in a soft egg-looking shell until their body fully develops. Then they come out. I guess it’s a mixture of natural hatching eggs and a metamorphosis with butterflies? :rofl:

Their power weakens as well because their energy is given from her. If she has weakened power, they will, too. And she does control how much she can give away because she doesn’t want them to hold enough to overthrow her.

They do think for themselves, but they are brainwashed into thinking she’s amazing and whatever. When they are sent on their terrorizing missions though, the queen has full control of them so if they start feeling empathy toward a victim, the queen will know and then get inside their head to either kill them or kidnap them. Kind of think of it as that episode of Spongebob where Planketon took over Spongebob’s brain. :rofl:

Yes! Same thing! They have to hold hands or at least touch their bodies so they can spread their power’s energy like a vine. c:

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They have to be physically touching?

You made it though :stuck_out_tongue:

So, when the Hero of Life, for example, says a spell, is the spell constructed the same way as a normal sentence would in Zispoel?

Idk why, but I love the sound of that name.

Reading that history of the language felt like I was looking into the etymology on a Wiki page XD You could write an encyclopedia of all your fictional languages.

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What if…the cave is no longer there but he doesn’t know it? Could he still transport?

I see. So like my bipedal lion race’s royals. The royals were the only ones gifted the solar magick from the sun (well, they believed it’s from the sun :stuck_out_tongue: ).

Do you imagine them as cute little babies or kinda weird looking?

Also, can the sirens do magic?

Interesting… like a vine. My Sorcerer race’s magick is like a blanket. It comes on top of you.

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There aren’t really “spells” in the first place. Magic is just a part of a beings’ body, so it’s more like riding a bicycle than wielding a power. So, sharing magic is like lifting someone above your head as opposed to chanting together. Make more sense?

Ugh I should and have tried but good lord

ty! :blush: It’s “River of the Hero” in Classical Zispoel.

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I would say yes, like on the outside of where it used to be. But if he wants to transport himself inside and it’s not there, he can’t. He’d probably just continue standing there like an idiot with his powers not working. :rofl:

Weird looking, definitely. :joy:

They can! But it’s more like manipulating the water and sea animals than like actual magic lol.

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I have some things I would like to ask pertaining to the magic systems in your story. You can hit me back with some questions as well.

I just have to think of some interesting ones.

I shall return soon enough. However, if you have questions, please ask me while I think of ones to ask you.

Wait, I have just the one, but you can hit me with plenty:

  1. Do your magical powers and spells come in colors? Like, if your magic is visible and tangible, could you see it in various colors, depending on the spell or whatever?

I hope that makes sense.

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That would be a funny scene XD

How do they manipulate sea animals? Is it all and any type of sea animal?

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